educated one

[LBLDOG]

 I went to the county this morning on a farm that my wifes boss owns( 2 to 300 acres) we got set up and started a little rabbit  distress  and after about 2 or 3 minutes this coyote is challenge barking at my buddy directly in front of him in a thicket .  I start challenging him back this goes on for a few minutes. I switch back and forth doing distress and challenge and boy is he getting mad but he wont come. I start back on distress and another ( sneaker) is coming my way to the distress. I dont have a good shot lots of brush in front of me, so I thought wait till he gets in clearing  , but he stops just shy of clearing . I know thought he is getting ready for flight ,so i put the red dot on him and let a 3 inch turkey load go and he bolted. I was so mad at myself but  4 buck is illegal  and I cant seem to make myself buy any dead coyote loads.(too high). I may have to put my steel choke in and shoot some t- load duck shells . ( they are on-sale at wally world) 

[Omega47]

The calling pattern you mention with the dogs not coming out of hiding is what we go through all the time on the property I hunt.  These dogs just won't show themselves if they aren't 100% sure of what they are getting into and as you can see from our other posts, their behavior will drive you nuts.

Hunting thicket with a shotgun doesn't seem like it would work too well.  Can you use a rifle where you are?  Heck, even a .22 with a decent scope would be better than trying to throw low velocity pellets through brush.   What other options do you have?  You know the coyotes are there - now you just have to figure out how to get them.   

[cb223]

I was so mad at myself but  4 buck is illegal  and I cant seem to make myself buy any dead coyote loads.(too high). I may have to put my steel choke in and shoot some t- load duck shells . ( they are on-sale at wally world) 

I know Dead Coyote is about $30 but is $3 to much to shoot a coyote? There is 10 coyotes in a box!
As few as my opportunities are I will take every advantage I can get.

My .02 worth.

[HaMeR]

I'm thinking decoy.

[THO Game Calls]

Hunting thicket with a shotgun doesn't seem like it would work too well

I'll put my 12 ga up against any rifle in the thick cover.   And win most days.

I agree with CB223, if all you can use is the T shot, then the Dead Coyote would be my choice.  I use #4 buck here. 

I keep reading these post where we talk about calling coyotes to us.  I think, and this is my opinon, that we might do better if we try to call the coyotes to where they want to go, and set up to cut them off.  If you try to force a coyote to do something it is not used to doing or not comfortable doing, like stepping out of the brush into a clearing, I think you will have a lot of tough days in the field. 

Set up not so that you can see the direction he is coming from, but so that you can see the direction he is going to go.   If you do that, the shotgun will work just fine.

Al

[DGF]

so far this weekend I have taken 3 coyotes useing a shotgun in heavy cover using dead coyote shot shells.

They are expensive, but there performance is outstanding definitly worth the extra money.

[cb223]

Set up not so that you can see the direction he is coming from, but so that you can see the direction he is going to go.   If you do that, the shotgun will work just fine.

Al

AL,

How do I know where they want to go?   

I'm pretty new to this game and have ALOT to learn!

I've called a few in but have yet to get a shot!


Thanks,Chad

[THO Game Calls]

I suppose the easiest way to look at it is, let's say you're a coyote and you're hungry.  You haven't been able to catch so much as a cold all night long and lord knows you've put in some miles trying.

Suddenly you hear a rabbit screaming for it's life.  You look up and say "Thank You God" and head right for that little bugger, saliva dripping off your chops and a gleam in your eye.   

You come busting in only to find the biggest baddest coyote you have ever laid eyes on tearing Mr. Bunny from limb to limb.  One look and you can see this is a "Hells Angle" coyote and he is NOT happy about you being there.  That being the case, he drops Mr. Bunny, who then looks up and says "Thank You God" and runs away, which of course pisses off Mr. Hells Angle Coyote even more, and he takes it out on you. 

After taking the butt whooping of all time, you limp back to your bedding area, beat up and still hungry.

With a little luck, you've learned a good lesson though.   Next time, you wont just go busting in like Rambo.

A lot of hunters tend to forget that generations of learning have taught Mr Coyote that if he is to survive, he needs to check things out before he comes busitng in to get Mr. Bunny.

A coyote's hearing is very very good.  He can pin point the source of a sound to within a few yards from a long ways away. 

His vision though, is just average.  He sees some colors, but most things are just shades.  But, and this is a big one, his ability to pick up movement is beyond good. 

As he comes into the sound, he is looking to see what's up.  He's being cautious and he's given himself an escape route should he see Mr. Hells Angle coyote again.

But we are sitting still, and, there is no movement. 

The coyote then does what he does best, puts his nose to work.  Watch one some time.  They come, they stop and look, if they dont see anything they keep coming but they start to make a wide circle.  They will stop and look for that movement, and when they dont see it, they keep moving until their nose can assure them that Mr. Hells Angle coyote is not there.  Or anything else that would ruin his day. 

Our goal as hunters then, is to try and determine where the coyote will come from, and, once he is on the way, where he is going to go to check things out with his nose.  He may circle 100 yards or more in open country, less in close cover.  But he is going to circle.  Most of the time that is.  We just have to figure out where he is going to go.  That I think, is the hardest part of coyote hunting.  Stand selection is more than finding a good spot to sit and call from, it is about being able to read the terrain and make an educated guess what the coyote will do when he comes to your call, but more importantly it is being able to use terrain features to funnel the coyote one way or another.  If we know he wont show himself in the field, then we sit with our back to the field and watch in the woods.   If we have a swamp or river on one side, we sit with our back to it, and watch the cross wind or down wind areas.  If we have really heavy thick cover that a rabbit would have a tough time in, and more open hardwoods on another side, that is where we watch.   The more you know about the area you are calling the better off you will be.

Every stand is different, but once you make enough stands, you will start to see things that are similar in many of them, and you will be better able to guess what is going to happen.   The wind is key, and since you know the coyote is going to use it to his advantage, plan your stand to use it to yours while allowing the coyote to do what is natural to him.   

Does this always work?

The second year I was coyote hunting my buddy Dave and I set up at the end of a narrow field.  The wind was in our face, and there was fresh snow on the ground.   The field was maybe 60 yards wide.  I crawled out and set an e caller dead in the middle of the field about 30 yards from the edge,  Then Dave went to the right and I went to the left and we sat in the corners with our backs to the field watching in the hardwoods.   We called for about 30 minutes with no takers on my side, and since I had not heard Dave shoot, figured he had the same luck.  We got up, walked out to pick up the e caller and there, right next to it, were a set of coyote tracks coming, and going.   He came right down the middle of the field, stuck his nose in the caller and left.  We never saw him even though he was right there in the open not more than 30 yards from from either of us.

So no matter what you do, just as Murray Burnham says "sometimes this shit don't worlk"   But you can certainly put the odds in your favor by using the wind and the trerrain to let the coyotes do what they do naturally.   

Al

edited to say this applies to day time hunting in thick heavy cover here in the east.  I have no experience out west or night hunting.

[cb223]

I made a separet post for this. "How to hunt this area" Please answer there
     http://www.finsandfur.net/forums/index.php?topic=4423.0



This is an Ariel photo of a stand I did Saturday with 2 friends.



I was the blue x with a rifle, it was semi open. Both of my friends were the red x's with shotgun's, much thicker where they were sitting. They were both around 100 yrds to either side of me. The green arrow is wind direction. We were on the edge of a creek bottom that was around 100 yrds wide and 30 feet below with the creek winding from one side to the other.


With my limited knowledge I figured if the coyotes were going to come in, they would most likely want to circle down wind. So they should follow along the top or bottom of the ridge not wanting to cross the river funneling them right to us.

Is this right or wrong.

There are coyotes in the area, I see tracks and scat. I don't know if this is a travel route, bedding or feeding. To be honest I'm not sure how to tell.

[CCP]

I figured if the coyotes were going to come in, they would most likely want to circle down wind.

You are correct they will mostly try to get down wind or get a visual. If they cant get down wind they will try for the visual next. Unless you are easily seen from another vantage point.

is a small clip and in it you can see when the coyote gets close he cuts back to our left getting down wind once he doesn't smell us (for whatever reason) he then comes on in.


In most cases I have found the coyote breaks off 80 to a 100yards to circle sometimes farther. It is rare for one to do it as close as this one did.

AL you are dead on in what you have said. So many times people think coyotes are looking for us as humans. In reality they are looking for the bunny and what caused it to make noises.

When I make a set I have a good idea of where he is hold up. My job is to setup so he feels safe coming to me. I then look for where he is going to check up or break off to circle. Those are the areas I try to setup the shot. Now if Iam hunting something like LBL I don't have time to scout I do more run and gun and hope for the best.

LBLDOG, I would suggest also to invest in a different load. Sounds as though you might be telling us a different story if you already had. I have killed several with a shotgun but it just isn't my choice of firearm except birds.

[THO Game Calls]

First thing I would do is walk that creek to the south of your possition and find a crossing point.  Once I found it, I would call from right there.  It would be a natural travel path that they are used to.  

If you can find a place where they have to travel because of the terrain, a huge part of the battle is won.  

One of my best spots is very similar to this.  I hunt the crossing, not only or coyotes, but deer too.  

Do you have a topo of this area?   It's hard to tell much because the scale is so small.  

Al

[wv_yoter]

Thanks Al and Richard, you guys make the learning curve easier for us new guys. LBLDOG good luck on the next one.

[Nelson]

Tho and CCP,

Thanks for the information and lessons, so we can learn.

Nelson

[coyotehunter_1]

Posted by: Nelson 

Tho and CCP,

Thanks for the information and lessons, so we can learn.

Yes, it's great that we have such "coyote smart" guys on here that are so willing to share their "real world" experiences.  

Novice or old dog, regardless of experience, we can all learn from each other. 

[Jimmie in Ky]

I can't see enough detail in this photo . But what I can see is several travel lanes in that area. I too would look for the creek crossing and see if theere is a setup nearby. I am also seeing a point sticking out into the field below your lettering for the 400 yards. It is more cross wind of the setup you used.

Travel lanes are the low places in th terrain.  Creeks , ditches, small swales, hollows in th side of the ridge, these are travel lanes. You can add field roads and fencerows to that list too. Al's little story gives some instight to the travel lanes. If you will give th coyote a way to aproach it will. As long as the coyote thinks it has some type of cover it will use it to get to th call. The coyote in AL's story used that low place to do just that.

Take your time and look things over a bit before you set up. Look for the deer trails and other odd places. When you practice looking for these it will become second nature. You will have a good idea of how they are most likely to come to you.Jimmie

[Kytimberman]

I spend hours, days, weeks, scouting, locating, hiking in, hiking out, and dragging Jimmie around with me, just so I can occaisionally call in a coyote once in what, maybe 25 or 30 stands?  But when I DO finally call one in, I want the best damn ammo for the job, and $3 a shell for a Dead Coyote load is CHEAP when you consider all you went through to get to that point!!  They do work well!  Get the choke tube to go with it.  And forget the steel shot, very bad idea.

[LBLDOG]

kytimberman,  thanks for the encouragement , I ordered a dead coyote choke and went toGANDER MTN. yesterday(WED)and bought some dead coyote loads. Im through with turkey loads  never never again will I use these! only for my turkeys this spring!